A gunman opened fire today at a Sikh temple outside of Milwaukee, killing six people and wounding at least three others, including a police officer, before being shot to death. Some witnesses say 4 "white" gunmen dressed all in black burst in and started shooting...
I am very afraid that we are going to find out the Sikh's were mistaken for Muslims =(
Edit: There was only one gunman...he had a 9/11 tattoo
The inner Machinations of my mind are an Enigma - Patrick Star
A steel fist in a Velvet glove, the force is there but it's concealed just below the surface.
Knowing that area of wisconsin, I think your assessment is correct. Brookfield/Waukesha is one of the most conservative and ignorant places in the midwest, used to work there. The other suburbs outside of Milwaukee aren't much better.
Actually, outside of Milwaukee and Madison, Wisconsin is a pretty ignorant place.
Outside of Madison. Milwaukee is still one of the most segregated and racist cities in the country. There are some things that make Milwaukee stand out from every other place in the country (in a good way)--the horrid bigotry, ignorance and cultural divisions there only do so in a bad way.
On a sidenote: poor, poor Milwaukee (and Wisconsin in general)...we only get headlines for insane, moron governors, serial killers, race riots and mass shootings. =\
"Answers without reasons are magic, not mathematics, Woolly Coati." -- the Space Hopper, Flatterland, by Ian Stewart
1) Why is it that the movie theatre shooting was instantly everywhere on the news but a massacre at a Sikh church seems to be a blip on the radar?
2) Why is this one being instantly labeled as 'domestic terrorism' but authorities refused to link the word terrorism with the movie theatre shooting?
And a comment that as HUGE as that church was, it's truly a shame if this was a 'mistaken for muslims' crime. There are obviously a ton of Sikhs there...you'd think people living in the area would know the difference. (And man, Sikhs in general, especially those that practice their religion, are some of the best people out there).
Morvran McGuinness {Shanks} *retired Barbarian rogue of the North, Vallon Zek
The more you leave dead, the less you need to watch your back
I told my brother and mom what had happened near by, and neither of them actually knew what Sikhs were. From the outside looking in, seeing a bunch of middle easterners wearing turbans, it's easy to make the mistake... even though the vast majority of people who wear turbans in america are Sikhs.
I think you're thinking of Zoroastrians if you're referring to Persian minority monotheistic religions. And, technically, Persian do count as Middle Eastern, just not Arab.
But, agreed, to most people it matters little and they lump all brown people into the Arab category...if they're being polite. It's nitpicky, but communicating clearly and correctly encourages people to think similarly, imo.
I think you're thinking of Zoroastrians if you're referring to Persian minority monotheistic religions. And, technically, Persian do count as Middle Eastern, just not Arab.
But, agreed, to most people it matters little and they lump all brown people into the Arab category...if they're being polite. It's nitpicky, but communicating clearly and correctly encourages people to think similarly, imo.
Zoroastrians are still a thing?
Also, apparently the FBI is actually looking into this as a terrorism attack.
Id say this was probably more of a domestic terrorist attack than the Aurora shootings. This one had a specific segment of society as a target, the Aurora one was just targeting who was around at the time.
and about as much news coverage on it, as on the Wisconsin shootings. Sadly, while I spent a couple of months living in Milwuakee, but Joplin is 20 mins or so away from my hometown in Oklahoma. It's were most of us from said small hometown spent a LOT of our free time. =(
Welcome to America, where you're free to worship any religion that's mainstream to us. =(
Welcome to America, where you're free to worship any religion that's mainstream to us. =(
I think that's a little harsh =/ Any of these attacks, whether attacks on life or attacks on property, regardless of the motive (religious, political, etc.) are illegal and unwelcome. It's a shame that anything like this occurs in our country, and it's a deeper shame that such events are becoming increasingly more common, but that doesn't offset the fact that two of America's strongest founding tenets are freedom of religion and freedom of speech. Many countries do not offer their citizens these freedoms at all, and very few offer them to the degree that the USA does.
I'm a Christian, but I stand by any Muslim or Sikh's right to assemble and worship peaceably, regardless of my religious disagreement with their theology. I would rather that there were no shootings, no arson, etc., but I am still very glad that throughout the country such people groups - mainstream or not - are protected by law, and I hope justice will be served to those which have participated in criminal activity against them.
I think that's a little harsh =/ Any of these attacks, whether attacks on life or attacks on property, regardless of the motive (religious, political, etc.) are illegal and unwelcome. It's a shame that anything like this occurs in our country, and it's a deeper shame that such events are becoming increasingly more common, but that doesn't offset the fact that two of America's strongest founding tenets are freedom of religion and freedom of speech. Many countries do not offer their citizens these freedoms at all, and very few offer them to the degree that the USA does.
I'm a Christian, but I stand by any Muslim or Sikh's right to assemble and worship peaceably, regardless of my religious disagreement with their theology. I would rather that there were no shootings, no arson, etc., but I am still very glad that throughout the country such people groups - mainstream or not - are protected by law, and I hope justice will be served to those which have participated in criminal activity against them.
The problem is, Kambic is that there is a very vocal group of Christians who don't feel that way.
There is currently an Amendment on the ballot in Missouri to increase the definition of religious freedom. The author of the Amendment, has been caught assuring constituents that the Amendment would only apply to Christians.
The problem is, Kambic is that there is a very vocal group of Christians who don't feel that way.
I know, and it disappoints me. Unfortunately, there have always been wings of Christianity which have felt that either by right or by usurpation, they should be able to use the machine of the government to coerce the consciences of men, whether that coercion be by sword or by law (if there is any difference), to submit to their flavor of religion.
The thinking is un-Christian and un-American.
Use the pulpit to preach religion, not the legislature.
...
Man, I've really gotten caught up in some of this stuff around here lately... I need a vacation.
Haha, not at all. Discussions with others who agree with you on every point can be fun, but do not tend to help you really examine what you believe and why.
I don't believe that just because faith makes assumptions about the world that that should be an excuse for inconsistency. I like the back and forth on here because it reveals to me inconsistencies in my way of thinking which need to be corrected, and I have many.
I over heard a patient talking to my boss about how as awful as it was/is...the problem is they "refused" to assimilate and thus drew attention to themselves so they kinda "started it"
I tried to explain that the way they look, meaning the turbans and clothing is required by their Religion but it was going over their heads.
They didn't even realize that Sikh is the 5th largest Religion in the World.
I can't understand how people can be so uneducated.
I can't understand how people can be so uneducated.
Because they have no curiosity about the world. They accept that whatever their parents told them is the absolute truth, and they refuse to ask questions and seek answers on their own.
You could replace "parents" with church, favorite "news" organization, neighbors, etc. It is also our nature to congregate with people who share those views, and it reinforces it. Differences scare us still for whatever reason.
The bottom line is people in America (I can only speak for here) are lazy and apathetic. Until something "threatens" their world view or lifestyle. Willful ignorance is almost a badge of honor for some/a lot of people.
My boss is still "scared" of Muslims...even ones who have been born in the US because "They" are the only Religion that encourages "Jihad" and killing others is required by their Religion.
It's pretty amazing, though, how similar some things can seem from the outside. Like, I did a little research on Sikhism, but I knew very little about it. I still don't really know what the differences between the Shia and Suni flavors of Islam are (I'll probably do some studying eventually).
I may have overdrawn from what you were saying, but my main point was just that confusion from the outside pretty much seems par for the course to me. I'm a Christian, but am neither Catholic nor Protestant; most people probably assume I'm Protestant, and I just let them.
I mean, if I had to hope that some day ONE mainstream religion was shown to be the right one, Sikhism would probably be my choice. These dudes (and dudettes) believe in equality for everyone, being good to others, standing up for what's right (and fighting for it). They don't do rituals, fasting, idols and they don't do manscaping. They eat what they want and many have a soft spot for the 420.
Then again the tenants at the heart of all mainstream religions are good at the root but twisted by the wielder.
I think that's a little harsh =/ Any of these attacks, whether attacks on life or attacks on property, regardless of the motive (religious, political, etc.) are illegal and unwelcome. It's a shame that anything like this occurs in our country, and it's a deeper shame that such events are becoming increasingly more common, but that doesn't offset the fact that two of America's strongest founding tenets are freedom of religion and freedom of speech. Many countries do not offer their citizens these freedoms at all, and very few offer them to the degree that the USA does.
I'm a Christian, but I stand by any Muslim or Sikh's right to assemble and worship peaceably, regardless of my religious disagreement with their theology. I would rather that there were no shootings, no arson, etc., but I am still very glad that throughout the country such people groups - mainstream or not - are protected by law, and I hope justice will be served to those which have participated in criminal activity against them.
I think the distinction you may be missing is that governmentally(idealistically?) the US was based on a doctrine of Free Speech and Free Religion (among other things). The people, however, have never supported those two as a whole. You can see it from the moment this country started - hence the slaves, the negative treatment of early Jews, and countless other things. Even the framers of the constitutions didn't necessarily practice what they preached.
So while the government permits you to say whatever you'd like (within reason) and practice whatever religion you'd like (also within reason - obviously they wouldn't be ok with a religion requiring ritual sacrifices of virgins), the guy down the street flying the confederate flag and the iron cross may not exactly be as gung-ho about those freedoms and would more closely resemble clearebrooks "America".
Honestly the day mankind realizes it doesn't need the trappings of religion to enjoy a spiritual life, the sooner we will have a chance for peace.
Sadly man still needs a few thousand more years of evolution before that has a chance.
"Forums: You have to form your opinions immediately based on jack s*it then fight them to the death! It's like Highlander, but instead of swords we use ignorance."
Honestly the day mankind realizes it doesn't need the trappings of religion to enjoy a spiritual life, the sooner we will have a chance for peace.
Sadly man still needs a few thousand more years of evolution before that has a chance.
I would take it one further, but am sure to be disagreed with, in that the day mankind realizes it does not need a bunch of spiritual nonsense and that the metaphysical is just a substitute for our current gaps in our knowledge of the physical, the sooner we will have a chance for peace.
But even then, I doubt it. We are humans, primates, animals, living things--we are prone to conflict of some sort. We make war for ideology, resources, geographic origin, shape and even for the occasional miscommunication. Until we are able to, on the individual level, celebrate that which makes us human (the single most ingenious and capable species we know of--a thing more worthy of celebration than any other) and minimize those instinctual forces that make us just another bipedal, shambling protein composite, we will not really have a chance for peace.
